Good Guy Gone Bad: The Story of Tressel
If Jim Tressel were a song, he would be Madonna's Don't Cry For Me, Argentina. The Sweater Vest is down and out, but not out of style.
That Tressel won't be roaming the sidelines of Ohio Stadium next season for the first time in 10 years will be hard to envision, but not necessarily difficult to fathom. Every Ohio State coach has departed at one time or another under less than ideal circumstances, and he prophetically has always surmised he would one day do the same.
And he was correct.
Ironically, he handed in his letter of resignation to Ohio State on Memorial day with a bit of a notable post script. The very events that led to his departure utterly define his persona, and are a microcosm of why some thought he would be the one to leave on his own terms.
Tressel departs Ohio State not as a liar; not as a manipulator and certainly not as a cheater. He leaves a man that cared for people--especially his players--and it's being that man that got him into trouble. He was a man that is larger than life, yet always smaller than the company he kept.
However, as easy as it might be to characterize the man with effusive praise and note how difficult replacing him will ultimately be, it's neither the time nor the place for such adoration or resignation to the eulogy of Ohio State football.
After all, as Tressel would be the first to say, the program is not about one individual or one coach. While the hurt and disappointment will resonate and linger for many months, the program will move forward. This too shall pass.
Tressel doesn't need the tears. He knew he was a man; like all men, ripe with mistakes. Whether by wins and losses or program-defining scandal, Tressel figured one day his time would expire as being worthy of the Ohio State head coaching label. For all his inherent goodness--the donations, the engagements, the philanthropy, the surprise visits to the sick and elderly--Tressel ultimately reaped what he sewed. He is responsible for his demise.
This began when Tressel failed to NCAA violations last April upon learning of some players selling their memorabilia. Tressel kept silent to protect them from embarrassment and discipline, though he stated, after the fact, concern over an ongoing criminal investigation and exercising discretion in the process. It's possible the Ohio State compliance office and thereby athletic department also learned of these allegations, and Tressel fell on the sword to protect that knowledge, but that's merely speculative to this point.
Regardless of Tressel's rationale he elected to keep quiet. It's not hard to suggest that he may have also been selfishly keeping his (acclaimed) 2010 football team out of trouble, but it's also likely his overwhelming concern was of the status of his pupils.
It's hard to imagine many men being able to sacrifice in that situation and do what he couldn't do: rat out his players to the suits of the NCAA. Still, being noble is an obligation to all, even if it's failed by most. But this past December, Tressel had a chance at redemption. And ultimately, missing that chance is what's likely led to his downfall.
When the allegations of five players selling their memorabilia leaked out this past December, leading to five-game suspensions for the start of the 2011 season, Tressel had the opportunity to come clean. Public sentiment of the Ohio State program, in lieu of those NCAA violations, was largely favorable given the small nature of the crimes. After all, who could really blame college kids for making a few bucks off their own belongings?
But when asked if Tressel had prior knowledge, he instantly opened Pandora's Box by telling a little white lie. That lie, which is what does not typically define Tressel and goes against the very thing he stands for, turned the tide of perception against Ohio State and has since created a tidal wave of negative publicity.
Since that time, media members have launched vigorous investigative journalism campaigns against the university, using freedom of information act requests to turn over every rock and knock down every barrier. But the media, overzealous and a bit too happy to oblige it may have been, was just doing what it's paid to do. They are storytellers and Tressel generously handed them the story.
Once it was discovered Tressel had such knowledge in advance of Ohio State finding out from the FBI, Tressel's plausible deniability of the program's transgressions was rendered null and void. He lost his ability to stand behind his reputation. Instead, he became just another rogue competitor.
Had Tressel told the truth from the beginning, at least the beginning as the public domain is concerned, he might have survived, his legacy saved and Ohio State's legal and PR teams may have been enjoying vacations these past few weeks. Instead, we're all feeling like this has turned into a classic Sunday School parable.
The sad reality is that this is an indictment as much on college athletics as it is Ohio State or Tressel specifically. The immense popularity of college football and predictable human nature committed these crimes. But it's Tressel's now-tarnished legacy that will be doing the time.
Nationally, Ohio State and Tressel will be lumped into a growing list of has-beens that couldn't practice what they preach. Unfair? Certainly. But that's exactly why Tressel would rather you spare him the tears. He knows he brought it on himself.
As Tressel will go quietly into the night, leaving behind 10 years of memories and some gaudy numbers in the process, eventually the disappointment will manifest itself as a perspective of what transpired: a good man with good intentions making bad choices. It's more than just a parable, it's a very valuable life lesson.
Ohio State will move on. They're likely to hire a successful head coach after next season. Whether Urban Meyer, Jon Gruden or someone else, the program will be in good hands once again. Interim head coach Luke Fickell will get a crack if he guides next year's team to prominence, but it's more likely he's just keeping the seat warm. The odds are stacked against OSU hiring from within, especially amidst a widespread perception of corruption.
It's assured the next coach will be compared to Tressel. If we've learned anything, though, it's that no coach should be compared to another but rather compared to the program itself. Because after all, that's ultimately what matters--the program.
But it's time to throw away Tressel's playbook. Blessing in disguise after all?
It's time to ignore the temptation to blame the media. They didn't cause this. It's time to shift focus on how good Tressel was, and instead focus on what the program can do to improve. After all, reliance on any one individual can be dangerous.
The program survives...coaches don't. Though Tressel didn't survive, I'll always think the sweater vest still made great fashion sense. It fit Ohio State like a glove.
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Good points
and good article too. Yesterday, I was listening to Chris Spielman, my all-time favorite Buckeye, on espn.com, and he essentially said Coach Tressel got off on the wrong foot with the March press conference. If he had stated he had made a terrible mistake, but wanted to correct it, perhaps he would have survived. We will never know.
Decisions have consequences, now Coach Tressel, and Ohio State football, have to bear those consequences. I will be anxious to see how Ohio State moves forward from this.
Good article, Kyle.
First, thanks Chip and everyone on the comments.
I definitely think Spiels is right about getting off on the wrong foot. Had he swallowed his medicine and come across as genuinely screwing up, it may have stopped a lot of anti-OSU momentum within the media. But as is, he came across as a fake, and everyone is eager to exploit a fake.
I selfishly hope that we find out, as I somewhat suspect, that he did in fact alert OSU compliance. It will obviously mean more damage to the program as a whole, but it will partially make me feel better about Tressel. Of course, if in fact he did alert compliance, then he never should have taken the fall for this and he should still be head coach. But it will at least reinforce my belief that Tressel is a better man than the character assassinations he’s now undergoing.
anti-OSU momentum within the media
The anti-OSU momentum within the media never stops. I don’t care how this sounds, but they (major sports media) attack us because that’s what makes them money, it’s what a lot want to hear and read. They want to read about because they don’t like us. They don’t like us because we are the best, as perennial a powerhouse as there gets. The anti-OSU momentum within the media didn’t start with these allegations or conclusions. The anti-OSU momentum within the media has been raging on for years and years. They hate because we’re constant conference champions, in their BCS games, their NC games. We’re as good as it gets as far as college football goes and other fans don’t like it, understandably so.
"I want my unwarranted optimism back." -Dilbert
by Simmsinns on May 31, 2011 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
You can talk all you want about the media being anti-OSU, but the same thing applies to Buckeye Nation as to Gator Nation. People don’t like smug winners and love to see them brought down low. Maybe you’re not that guy, maybe the people on this board aren’t that guy, but there are a lot of OSU fans who gloat like mad when OSU wins, and take even valid criticism of OSU far too personally. The kind of people who made Kirk Herbstreit’s life in Columbus so unbearable. You know those people. I do, too. The monster that OSU and their fans have created have a significant bearing on the amount of schadenfreude going on here.
@grantgw - sports and Cleveland and Columbus stuff
by woodsmeister on May 31, 2011 3:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Really?
Name me one, not ten, but one coach that the media has called for their job. As for Herbie, you don’t know what you don’t know.
The media calls for the job of every coach. Usually it’s for poor performance, but most coaches who get caught cheating in the way that Tressel are forced to fall on their swords immediately, or they move on, Does anyone really think that Pete Carroll would have retained his employment at USC if he hadn’t left for Seattle? There’s a reason that Calipari job hops so often – by the time the NCAA catches up to him, he’s moved on. Listen, I like Tressel – I root for Ohio State, although I did not go there, because I am from Ohio and I am proud of where I’m from, but sometimes I look around at “Buckeye Nation” and think that we bring a lot of crap on ourselves because of our behavior. If someone hates you, the reasonable response is to first ask whether there is anything hateful in your behavior toward that other person.
@grantgw - sports and Cleveland and Columbus stuff
by woodsmeister on May 31, 2011 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions
RichRod at U-M
There was a massive expose in the Detroit Free Press outlining the extra practice time scandal that resulted in some moderate sanctions against the program.
Unfortunately, it didn’t lead to his downfall – his terrible record in the B1G did!
Kirk Ferentz earlier this year
Everyone was clamoring for his head after Rhabdogate. I tend to agree with woodsmeister in this regard: The only reason that anyone is enjoying this experience is due to the arrogant OSU fans. I am not calling anybody in particular arrogant (lord knows Iowa has enough d-bags at time that I can’t throw stones) but OSU fans seem to be the first to jump on the criticism bandwagon when it comes to other schools and the most sensitive about criticism.
Iowa fans can probably sympathize with OSU fans’ reaction to media coverage since we went through an incident that was made so much worse by the media than it should have been earlier this year. I don’t take pleasure in Tressel quitting (or being forced to quit as the case may be) because I think that he should have quit or been fired a long time ago. Knowingly lying to the NCAA (no matter your intention or the topic) is a serious enough offense to warrant that.
"I shoot, I score. He shoots, I score." - Dan Gable
by ClaybornSmash on May 31, 2011 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions
You got me
You are correct about ferentz. I just remember how no one called for Butch Davis, Pete Carrol, Nick Saban and others who have recently run afoul of the ncaa.
I think if Carroll hadn't tucked tail and ran to the NFL, you'd have seen some calls for his head.
Innovators look at the same thing as everyone else, yet see something different.
by K. Scott Bailey on May 31, 2011 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions
But none of those coaches knowingly and blatantly lied to the NCAA. There is a really big difference there.
It all relates to winning. If Kirk Ferentz had beaten Jim Tressel more than once, I think you’d see much less vitriol coming from the Iowa community.
Wisconsin, the Big Ten program with the most success against Tressel, has probably been the least vindicative of any major fanbase, at least from my gathering.
I don't see much vitriol coming from Iowa
but then again I tend to try to ignore the idiots from every fanbase (including my own). I tend to go to sites that can have a civil discussion about the issues. While there are some that I’ve seen that are gleeful that Tressel is going to be gone, the majority of the people I’ve seen simply feel like he got what he deserved for lying to the NCAA. Some even sympathize with his position as caught between trying to protect his players and NCAA regulations that many feel are antiquated and in need of updating.
I understand your point on success against Tressel being a direct indicator of vitriol, but I think that is a simplification. I could very easily have said the same thing about the reaction to Ferentz but that would also have been simplistic IMHO. I think each fanbase has had different encounters with OSU that tends to shape reaction to negative news. Obviously Michigan is going to be ecstatic about this, but then Wisconsin who is not a perennial rival and has had some success has been more muted on the subject.
Maybe success against Tressel can be used as a gauge as to how OSU fans interact with other fanbases: More wins against Tressel means less arrogance is perceived by opposing fanbases. I honestly am not sure but all I know is that I would not want to connected to the lowest common denominator of my fanbase anytime, let alone when the majority of my fellow Hawkeye fans are being restrained in their reactions. I am curious though as to where you are seeing the vitriol coming from Iowa (if you link to HawkeyeNation.com I will just ignore it so don’t bother).
"I shoot, I score. He shoots, I score." - Dan Gable
by ClaybornSmash on May 31, 2011 5:03 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree. Iowa fans are generally enjoyable to be around. My point, which I did not make very well, is that Ohio State and Jim Tressel have come under fire more than others because they win more than others. No one really cares if Butch Davis instructed agents to pay players at North Carolina. He’s a non-entity in college football.
That I agree with
Success breeds scrutiny. That is the price that you pay for winning. It also means that people are going to be less sympathetic when things (inevitably) go wrong.
"I shoot, I score. He shoots, I score." - Dan Gable
by ClaybornSmash on May 31, 2011 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Most of the vitriol came from the fact that we wanted Tressel
to keep his job. But it has definitely been ongoing since March. Here is how I would rate the various fanbases in their hate: #1 Penn State, #2 scUM (very close to PSU though), #3 Iowa.
Verify by the comments on BSD, mgoblog, and BHGP. It’s alright though, I understand. The man has been crushing your dreams for a decade.
Looking forward to the karmic payback.
Respectfully
Many would say that this whole saga is the karmic retribution.
by OctaShields on May 31, 2011 11:18 PM EDT up reply actions
To simplify the idea to one sentence…
Karmic retribution means that every deed or action has consequences and evil deeds bring about suffering.
From the Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy
by OctaShields on May 31, 2011 11:45 PM EDT up reply actions
“Poetic justice” would be a more common phrase for that idea. But the truth is, when it comes to sports fans, it’s all relative. So even if “karma” was real, which has never been scientifically recorded in a controlled environment, it would appear different for every fanbase. Not only are there entirely different perspectives, but there are also a ton of “good” and “bad” fans amongst each group. So again, if “karma” existed, it doesn’t, every time it was making a “bad” fan suffer, there are countless good fans suffering for no reason. How is that just?
The whole concept is quite ludicrous.
"I want my unwarranted optimism back." -Dilbert
I wouldn't put BHGP in league with BSD and mgoblog.
At BHGP (and sometimes mgoblog), in my experience, you can have an honest and open disagreement about Ohio State, and the residents are tolerant of you if you’re nice. BSD and mgoblog residents are much more hostile towards Ohio State; you’ve got to walk on eggshells to get along, and even then you’re going to take some mean-spirited flak. I can’t totally put my finger on why the reactions are different, but I’d suggest it’s some combination of editorial policy plus “rival-specific” focus plus moderation standards.
Hell, what do I know. I may or may not be two sheets to the wind right now.
I think the innuendo out there is that I'm just picking and choosing which guys to run off, and people bring it up that I've medical-ed more people. Well, yeah, I medical them...I don't make those decisions, either. The doctors make them, and we have great doctors." -Nick Saban
by Semicorrect on Jun 1, 2011 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I would agree with this
I would say there was more vitriol at BHGP in the comments section from an article on Ferentz being an asshole or not than anything Tressel related. If you consider the comments at BHGP on this whole thing to be hateful, then I feel very sorry for you and your thin skin.
"I shoot, I score. He shoots, I score." - Dan Gable
by ClaybornSmash on Jun 1, 2011 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions
Not on BHGP but how about this on OTE
BentNotBroken:
Tressel was a huge cheater. Those who deny this fact, please remove your buckeye where ever it may be placed at this moment… Not only was Tressel a documented cheater – he has a gang of fools who defend him because he won. Well, winning isn’t everything, but brand new Nissan Z cars, those are everything!!
Granted there’s some tongue-in-cheek going on but I fully believe BentNotBroken believes this. He posts regularly to BHGP, right?
After four months of being attacked from every angle, you’d probably have a thin skin too. And no, the Hawkeyes run-ins with the Iowa City PD don’t count as an equivalent level of scrutiny.
Do you really want me to start cherry picking comments?
I’m sure I can easily find any number of negative comments about something related to Iowa from regular posters here.
My point was not that there were no negative comments but that the level of discourse on the topic at BHGP was more than simple OSU/Tressel bashing. Read this and this and let me know if most of the people commenting are being unfair and/or hateful. There is more discussion about how college football players spend money and time, whether the Big Ten should adopt a stipend that Delaney proposed and the definition of civil disobedience than hateful comments towards OSU.
You think I don’t understand being attacked from every angle? The entire Rhabdo situation earlier this year had Iowa/Ferentz being attacked from every news publication, blog and non-Iowa CFB fan. I understand just fine and can empathize with your situation.
"I shoot, I score. He shoots, I score." - Dan Gable
by ClaybornSmash on Jun 1, 2011 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions
I concede
Can’t talk about this anymore. It’s too depressing.
When are you guys going to create a D-I men & women’s hockey team? Would there be any support for it in Iowa City?
There is definitely interest among the fanbase
but there is little in the way of realistic plans. Here is a Fanpost at BHGP from earlier this year about this topic.
In short, the most feasible solution would be to have a wealthy donor come up with the funding for the program, as it is unlikely to be completely financed by the university, and they would play at the hockey arena in Cedar Rapids (a 30 minute drive from IC).
"I shoot, I score. He shoots, I score." - Dan Gable
by ClaybornSmash on Jun 1, 2011 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions
My thoughts also. I think the writers and commenters at BHGP are reasonable, engage in pretty good discourse, a good bunch of fans and not at all a$$holish; compared to say the BSD or mgoblog crowds.
"I'm not a psychopath, Anderson, I'm a high-functioning sociopath. Do your research." - Sherlock Holmes
Thing is…the media and other fanbases love to change their ‘perception’ of OSU depending on what point they want to prove. First off…we get the OSU is the true definition of a football ‘goliath…’ And then, depending on the issue, that same ‘goliath’ is to be mocked as a team that can’t win the big game and gets regularly spanked in bowl games against SEC teams.’
by johnnyphoenix on May 31, 2011 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree with the photo posted
Great write by the way, well said.
To err is human, we must take the good with the bad no one is perfect and at some point one must add up all the good one does and is and put into perspective the bad, in the end the bad part was nothing Tressel did him self but what he allowed others to do, you my accuse him of pointing some in one direction or another but I highly doubt he pointed any player to the tattoo parlor!
For all that has happened I believe it is important for those of the OSU to keep the good parts of his legacy alive.
Remember folks it could be worse, you could have just hired RR.
it's not that you are stupid, it's just that you don't suspect!
Nothing is good nor bad until compared to something else.
Interesting article
Let’s not kid ourselves here, what he did wasn’t such a grave thing. Instead of focusing on the archaic ncaa rules (like they did for Boise St), everyone latched on to the fact that he wasn’t forthcoming. This wasn’t like a case where he steered players into the arms of boosters to fill their pockets with untold riches. He didn’t hide or cover up player’s commiting lawless acts. He simply didn’t tell about kids selling their own stuff. The media and others have spun this to be such a huge deal, “oh, he lied, he is bad.” Give me a break! People have given this waaaaaay too much thought. The rules are antiquated and hypocritical, that should have been the story!
But...they ARE the rules. You don't have to like them, you just have to play by them. Unless you don't get caught.
Or
You can admit the rules are archaic and change them. These changes will only come after the realization of the absurdity is acknowledged. The ncaa has not evolved at all. Today TOSU is under the gun, who will be next? Could be your team next.
My team has been in plenty of trouble in the past.
I don’t deny the rules, or some of them, are archaic. I also think the particular rule(s) in question here is a good one. Unless you can explain how lying to the NCAA makes sense…or how allowing players to receive preferential treatment from merchants or boosters makes sense.
I agree
There isn’t a justification for lying. The reality is that as long as there are fans, there will be people that will want to know them. I don’t ever see a world where a player won’t get a freebie from an adoring fan. In my mind, the only solution is to define the penalties differently. Maybe use the misdemeanor/felony model? I do think there is a difference between an athlete who receives a free meal to one who receives a free car. I don’t profess to know the answer, just think that the system is a flawed and outdated one.
Yeah Sleeping on Kellen Moore Floor is a huge!
like they did for Boise St
Or how about that peanut butter smammitch he made recruit… dude I’ll give you their Tennis coach was a complete f’up but lets not try to to compare the two, your in morning as am I yet the ship still floats.
it's not that you are stupid, it's just that you don't suspect!
Nothing is good nor bad until compared to something else.
When I find one I will
Till then it deserved that reply!
it's not that you are stupid, it's just that you don't suspect!
Nothing is good nor bad until compared to something else.
by Darth Prophet on May 31, 2011 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I spent most of yesterday reflecting on Tressel's impressive career.
We are all guilty of criticizing The Vest for the small stuff, but the big stuff is what counts. He coached this school to seven Big Ten titles, three National Championship appearances and eight total BCS game appearances, took a gamble on creating a QB competition between a blue-chip stud recruit and a lesser-known all-around athlete and got a Heisman trophy winner out of it, and beat M*ch*g*n every year but once.
He was a winner. Even if he drove us nuts for running too much Dave, punting on 4th and 1, ignoring the spread offense, or taking his foot off the gas after a healthy lead, he won a bunch of games. The important thing for me is to remember JT fondly as the coach who won us a National Championship my freshman year at tOSU, and gave me a crapload of great teams to root for my remaining four years. After a loss, his “aw shucks” press conferences made me discard the angry emails I almost sent to my dad and uncles.
Fast forward to now, I am critical of his lapse in judgement on these issues, but I won’t crucify him for it. There are people who do wrong for personal gain and those who do it for the benefit of others. Tressel was doing the latter by keeping his mouth shut. He’s not a bad guy, he just used bad judgment.
"I slyde my boehner into sexsalad...."
Sounds like a johnu1 production. --jch24
This coach walks away from the game a champion.
Tressel’s Legacy:
106–22 overall
7 Big Ten championships
4 BCS Bowl wins
1 National Championship
9-1 vs. Michigan
Tressel will be remembered in time was one of the greatest college football coaches of all-time, and the greatest of my generation. Thanks for the memories, Jim. Your coaching has led to personal experiences I’ve shared with my family and friends that I couldn’t have possibly ever dreamed off. For that I’m eternally grateful.
"I want my unwarranted optimism back." -Dilbert
by Simmsinns on May 31, 2011 12:57 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
I think what he got canned for – lying to investigators – didn’t give him any kind of competitive advantage, so it shouldn’t tarnish his record as a coach.
Tattoos and rent payments don’t offer any kind of competitive advantages on the football field either. Tressel remains a champion and one of the greatest coaches ever.
"I want my unwarranted optimism back." -Dilbert
by Simmsinns on May 31, 2011 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Disagree.
The lying was to cover-up the fact that he knowingly played ineligible players. Ineligible players=Competitive advantage. That is the proximate cause of his resignation.
by rogerja on May 31, 2011 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
He’s not getting fired for playing ineligible players. Had he come clean about that from the get-go, I think he would still have a job.
But he did
play ineligible players. if he hadn’t played ineligible players, he wouldn’t have had to lie.
Had he come clean in April 2010, we would not be talking about the Sugar Bowl champion Ohio State Buckeyes. How does a whole 2010 season of Scott Bauserman at QB sound in hindsight?
@grantgw - sports and Cleveland and Columbus stuff
by woodsmeister on May 31, 2011 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions
If he had informed the players of the improper benefits in April 2010, the players likely would have each received a four game suspension, a punishment consistent with A.J. Green’s error. You can try predicting how the season would have went with that hurdle, but I don’t see the value in it.
Well, let’s speculate anyway. Let’s say it’s the Tat-Five plus Whiting and nobody else suspended for the first four games. Maybe Miami beats OSU; I think it’s a toss-up. The other three games are gimmes. Everybody returns, and the season resumes as usual, OSU losing to Wisconsin and pulling it out against Iowa. At worst, it’s a 9-3 year.
Of course if the standard is what we’ve learned now I would think it very unlikely that we’d have had an investigation like Sports Illustrated’s into the program and I couldn’t possibly predict the 2010 season. 8-4, maybe?
I think the innuendo out there is that I'm just picking and choosing which guys to run off, and people bring it up that I've medical-ed more people. Well, yeah, I medical them...I don't make those decisions, either. The doctors make them, and we have great doctors." -Nick Saban
so...
Win at all costs?
“Tressel departs Ohio State not as a liar; not as a manipulator and certainly not as a cheater. "
Except for the minor detail that he DID lie, he DID manipulate, and he DID cheat.
Apart from that, it’s an accurate statement.
by jthomas666 on Jun 1, 2011 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I think this is too narrow of a view of exactly what Tressel was doing (or not doing) wrong and the effects, both indirect and direct, that it had on the football field.
As rogerja said, Ohio State played ineligible players and gained a direct competitive advantage by virtue of that violation. It wasn’t really a gray area, it was pretty clear that at least 5 guys had violated NCAA rules and should have received some kind of suspension, so failing to disclose and allowing them to play was clearly a competitive advantage.
But there is also an indirect competitive advantage. It’s hard, if not impossible, to quantify. But any amount of critical thinking will reveal that fostering a climate at your school that is more permissive of semi-pro activities (from receiving impermissible benefits, however innocent they seem, to cash handshakes and booster bagmen doing your bidding) is a competitive advantage in recruiting. It’s pointless to speculate on specific instances where this advantage might have come into play (as others have done with Terrelle Pryor specifically), because we can’t know exactly what makes one player choose one school over another unless we exist inside their brain. But you can say that, at the very least, presenting opportunities for players to live a more glamorous lifestyle while technically student-athletes doesn’t hurt you in recruiting, and at most, has helped you attract and sign several players who may not have otherwise chosen OSU.
by OctaShields on May 31, 2011 11:39 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Whoa
Never was it said that there was a payola scandal happening. Some things a recruit might find influencing would be their ability to reach the NFL, tradition, etc. Besides, you are assuming that OSU is the only place that players get special treatment. Look at your team and explain how they got thousands of dollars worth of tattoos.
I agree that there are plenty of other reasons for a big recruit to choose Ohio State, including the tradition, NFL opportunities, etc. I wasn’t assuming anything, simply stating that consideration of the type of lifestyle they will be able to live while a student-athlete is one factor that I’m sure many recruits consider.
We can’t know how determinative any single factor is for a recruit. It could be completely irrelevant; it could be the deciding factor. Who knows. It’s not like blue chip guys take tours of Bowling Green, hear from current players that they can get cheap cars, tattoos and other perks like occasional cash handouts by virtue of playing on the football team, and decide to go there instead of somewhere else.
Ohio State has a lot of legitimate selling points, and I never meant to imply otherwise. But on top of everything else, again, I say it can’t hurt recruiting when a more permissive climate exists where people in charge generally look the other way.
Need more time to digest
Read in a paper (Dispatch?) that charities in central Ohio are concerned that see a lack of donations now that JT is out. That speaks volumes for the man. However, he also committed one of two cardinal sins of the NCAA – he lied. Couch it how you will, but he lied not once, not twice, but at least three times to the NCAA and/or university.
Time will tell if that stain sticks. In the near future, the only thing that helps him is if the Cam Newton story is proven true, or if a similarly-statured program gets hit with something. But rest assured, other schools’ compliance departments are scrambling to get ahead to this before it hits them.
When did he lie to the NCAA. He did sign a generic (and extremely broad) certificate of compliance, but when did he actually lie to the NCAA about what happened or didn’t happen?
His lie, in his defense, was to the media, not the NCAA.
Notice of allegations
September, 2010 – The form. You and I may differ as to whether it’s a “lie” to sign a form stating that you know of no complaince issues, when, in fact, you do. At the very least it’s wilfull deception.
December, 2010 – By all reports, he was asked by OSU if he had knowledge of players selling stuff for tats. He said he did not.
January, 2011 – Asked again if he had knowledge, he said no.
February 8, 2011 – Comes clean in interview with OSU/NCAA investigators.
Ask yourself this one question
If you see your parent or relative speeding do you call the police and report them? That is EXACTLY what the offense is.
Not a fair analogy
In very few instances are citizens required to report crimes, even as they are ongoing (there’s a tragic case out of NYC that demostrates this).
Now, if you’re a traffic cop and you pull over a car, only to find out that it’s your relative, do you let him go? Most of us, probably. How about if you boss asks you if you let your relative go? Do you come clean? Maybe the second time you are asked?
In other words, if you do something wrong, even if it’s to cover-up the wrongdoing of another, be prepared to accept the consequences.
The point is that too many criticize what he did when they would have done the same. What he did was not illegal! Actually look at what he didn’t report. Was it felonious?
To be fair
I was a Tressel supporter/apologist up until it became clear that he was sending Sarniak the information. To me, this blew a hole in his “protecting the confidentiality of a federal investigation” defense. I can still, through lots of distorted thinking, see how he thought he was protecting his players.
Presuming to know
I appreciate that you are a fan, but i have to disagree. Do you know what he sent Sarniak? Remember when it was reported that he called an FBI agent? Turns out that it had nothing to do with the current players. Speculation is not fact.
I know he forwarded the intial email
that started everything. That’s not speculation, that’s fact. OSU released this last month. There are others that they are fighting the release of over student privacy.
I agree with Rogerja. It is a competitive advantage to knowingly play ineligible players. As for those saying “it hasn’t been linked to Tressel or OSU” they are missing the point. Tressel, as head coach, IS OSU for the purposes of the NCAA. And Tressel’ proven to be anything but truthful to the NCAA in a few instances here. If you’re gonna claim ignorance of violations, like USC attempted (when it was only proven an assistant coach knew) then you need at least an honest image. That’s gone. OSU’s “we didn’t know” defense will not suceed.
I hate all this though. By and large the tatoo thing probably goes on in one form at alot of schools ( prolly evey school in the sec except vanderbilt). We Do not want teh NCAA diggin’ around all of our glass houses!
OSU will be fine. but waiting for the sanction is the worse. As a bama fan i know. The wait is worst than the certainty of punishment. Hang in there.
by TheYellowHammer on May 31, 2011 2:29 PM EDT reply actions
Competitive advantage because of an arbitrary label that is placed on a speculative event?
Competitive advantage is something that makes it harder for another team to beat you. No one is at a disadvantage because Terrelle Pryor played. Whether he got a tattoo in exchange for his signature or not, it doesn’t change the ability or inability for other teams to beat Ohio State. Ohio State is not gaining anything from Pryor exchanging tattoos for memorabilia.
If Ohio State were paying recruits, having their players take performance enhancing drugs, etc… that would be a competitive advantage.
Having Terrelle Pryor at quarterback instead of Scott Bauserman is not a competitive advantage?
@grantgw - sports and Cleveland and Columbus stuff
by woodsmeister on May 31, 2011 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions
To begin, his name is Joe, not Scott. He may not be a star, but I think we can at least give him proper recognition.
There is a lot of confusion over what constitutes a competitive advantage, not only on here but in the sports media, where people are payed to understand this stuff. This is mostly due to the NCAA’s muddled regulations and even more muddled ruling process.
For an improper benefits case to end in competitive advantage charges, there must be proof that an athletes’ amateur status was endangered. Losing amateur status is not something that can be reversed with time. Once it’s proven to be gone, it’s gone. USC vacated games because Reggie Bush was found to have violated his amateur status with agent contact and payment. Improper benefits alone does not lead to a loss of amateur status; it must be egregious, involve an agent, or both.
Ohio State’s players, as of today, still maintain their amateur status, and most of them probably will retain it after this investigation. The sole exception is Pryor, who may have violated his amateurism with more improper benefits than the others.
Two types of advantages recognized by the NCAA
19.02.2.1 Violation, Secondary. A secondary violation is a violation that is isolated or inadvertent in nature, provides or is intended to provide only a minimal recruiting, competitive or other advantage and does not include any significant recruiting inducement or extra benefit. Multiple secondary violations by a member institution may collectively be considered as a major violation.
19.02.2.2 Violation, Major. All violations other than secondary violations are major violations, specifically including those that provide an extensive recruiting or competitive advantage.
From the Notice of Allegations:
“It was reported that Jim Tressel … permitted football student athletes to participate in intercollegiate athletics competition while ineligible.”
I’d venture a guess that the NCAA thinks playing ineligible athletes is a competitive advantage.
Ohio State, to this point, has only been charged with secondary violations. By the NCAA’s own definition, secondary violations provide or intend to provide only “minimal” advantage.
Ohio State did not gain an advantage because some players swapped tits for tats.
You sure?
In the letter to OSU, the NCAA specifically state that the allegations are presuemd to be major, unless designated secondary.
There are two allegations in the Notice, involving the violation of five NCAA bylaws, with the potential for more. Nowhere in that document does it designate any allegation as secondary. Further, the 10.1 violation involving Coach Tressel is major.
Yes I’m sure. And nowhere in the notice of allegations does it state a presumption of being major. It says they’re treated as potentially major, but that designation has not occurred to this point.
Specifically, the 10.1 bylaw is not a minor or major violation. It’s a violation against individuals. It can be considered “major,” but by default it isn’t given a label. That designation is often made, as is others, made by the enforcement staff at the hearing.
Second, Ohio State was NOT charged with Failure to Monitor or Failure to Control, which are the charges typically levied when the school commits major violations or several secondary violations that rise to the level of being major collectively. That could still be added later, but that is a significant fact in this case that they’re not being charged with either.
The other violations are typically secondary violations. In fact, the 12.1.2.1.6 violations are minor enough that any eligibility is restored upon repayment of the value of the benefits.
I’m not saying Ohio State is out of the woods or more won’t be added. But right now, they absolutely not have been charged specifically with a major violation.
NCAA compliance
OSU has been too forthcoming with the ncaa. They could have done what everyone else does, issue a bland statement. Their fault was trying to appease a blood thirsty media. They were further reviled by their dumb press conferences. Lsu and oregon are being investigated right now due to payments to a recruiting service. Their reply? No comment. The salivating hater’s in the media and the country were going to persecute anyway, and won’t stop. They didn’t have a disdain for OSU and Coach Tressel because of the recent news, they use speculation as fact to validate their own smarmy opinions. OSU’s fault was being too open.
Ohio has a FOIA-type law
If a public institution like OSU is not compliant with that law, it’s a real crime. With respect to the press they’ve been no more open than they are required to be, and they’ve dragged their feet as much as they can.
The NCAA is a voluntary organization, which makes the universities a ton of money. OSU could leave, but they want the cash. And they and the other universities need some enforcement, or they’ll wind in a bidding war for players with T. Boone Pickens and Phil Knight. They (and other big football programs) would be okay, but it would drive up the cost of doing business.
Their problem is really delicate: they need to be just open enough that they don’t make the NCAA look bad enough to get people looking at other structures, not so open that they get more hammered than they need to be. This probably means that Gee and Smith will continue to act like fools. At this point, OSU is better off looking stupid than crooked.
by patrickdolan on Jun 2, 2011 12:26 AM EDT up reply actions
I agree and thank you for the info! I was using the logic of a criminal trial that sometimes the less said the better. I have seen many times where the defense approaches a case by putting the burden of proof on the defendant. A “lawyering up” if you will. It seemed to me that the administration wanted to win the public opinion and opened themselves up for more criticism. Thanks again.
Gene Smith is Brutus?
Non Sibi Sed Patriae ;I bleed Scarlet and Grey...A Buckeye for Life.
In Bill We Trust.
recd btw. Where did you get it from?
Non Sibi Sed Patriae ;I bleed Scarlet and Grey...A Buckeye for Life.
In Bill We Trust.
If I had to guess EDSBS
LSUfreek and EDSBS crew are gif artists
"I shoot, I score. He shoots, I score." - Dan Gable
by ClaybornSmash on May 31, 2011 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Not to sound like a “Maury guest” but I hope the haters are getting their fill.
Listening to Mark May butcher facts on ESPN. Looking at Desmond Howard’s twitter account. Coming into contact with SEC fans. Reading Iowa fans/trolls on the web. They are all loving every minute of this. Can’t blame them. We would do the same if it was a SEC school. The only thing America loves more than a winner is to watch them burn.
But, I hope these clowns get their fill, because tOSU will be back, sooner than many expect. When it happens, I hope that Urban/Gruden/whoever walks to the podium after a 57-3 ass whooping of Iowa and answers the question of “Why did you go for two when you were up 55-3?” with a simple “because I couldn’t go for three.” Then continues to drop bombs on the rest of the schedule, including TSUN.
We’re down, but we aren’t out, and I can’t wait to start kicking some ass.
by Bernie19Kosar on May 31, 2011 4:58 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs
I have to ask
Where are these “Reading Iowa fans/trolls on the web”? I live in Iowa and visit the good Iowa message boards and I haven’t seen many cases of people hating on OSU beyond the feeling that Tressel should have resigned or been fired before this point.
"I shoot, I score. He shoots, I score." - Dan Gable
by ClaybornSmash on May 31, 2011 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions
It's not like Iowa's Penn State.
Those guys are revaling in this. Even moreso than TSUN fans.
Yeah, BSD is eating this up
"I shoot, I score. He shoots, I score." - Dan Gable
by ClaybornSmash on May 31, 2011 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions
They gotta have something to discuss over there related to football relevance. Other than that they are counting Paterno’s kidney stones.
by johnnyphoenix on May 31, 2011 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
There were some on other Ohio State websites.
Nothing horrible, just in the front of my mind.
by Bernie19Kosar on May 31, 2011 7:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Coming into contact with SEC fans
Yeah…makes you want to take a shower and get a teeth cleaning afterwards…if only because it reminds you how great it is to have them.
Reading Iowa fans/trolls on the web.
I haven’t heard much from them…you gotta allow for some degree of mockery from the other big ten teams.
by johnnyphoenix on May 31, 2011 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions
They hate us because we are the best. They can kick us while we are down, but we’ll keep that in mind when we hire the best available coach and are back on top.
"I want my unwarranted optimism back." -Dilbert
SEC fans think chanting “S-E-C” constitutes a 3 syllable word.
by johnnyphoenix on May 31, 2011 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
A little levity, provided by Brian Rolle.
I have to admit I got 4 free things in college and they were wins against Michigan…easiest I’ve ever got # Bums # OH"
by Tyler T. on May 31, 2011 5:13 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs
BOOOOOOOOOOM.
"What do we have here?"
"We're going to Saint Croix."
"We are? Oh, goody. I'm so happy."
"Well, I hope you're happy for us, because it's just Carrie and me."
"I see. Once again I humiliate myself by assuming that I'm a member of this family."
-Arthur and Doug, bantering about the Heffernan's vacation plans
The rumor du jour right now is that Pryor has consulted with multiple agents in the last week and he is going to enter the NFL Supplementary Draft.
He's got the tats to prove it.
/weeps.
"What do we have here?"
"We're going to Saint Croix."
"We are? Oh, goody. I'm so happy."
"Well, I hope you're happy for us, because it's just Carrie and me."
"I see. Once again I humiliate myself by assuming that I'm a member of this family."
-Arthur and Doug, bantering about the Heffernan's vacation plans
The question with Pryor is where he’ll play in the NFL. Does anyone think a team would be willing to sign him as a QB and see if they can discover and NFL QB skillset within him, or is it a foregone conclusion that he’s going to be a WR/hybrid TE type?
by OctaShields on May 31, 2011 11:56 PM EDT up reply actions
He’s a BUM. That’s all I know. Hopefully nowhere.
by johnnyphoenix on Jun 1, 2011 1:38 AM EDT up reply actions
It will be interesting
That is the real question. His athleticism is unquestioned, but his mechanics etc are question marks. Gruden was in town and said he believed that he could play qb in the NFL. I would have to believe that someone will see the potential that every major program in the country saw when they recruited him. He has Charlie Batch as a mentor and maybe he can sell TP to a gm somewhere. The NFL says that character matters, but the truth has been that if they think he has upside he will get a shot.
all parties involved should hand out free liquer to the people of columbus for so we can drown our sorrows
btw, did anyone hear common man and the torg today… bobby carpenter was interviewing and getting into a little with the guy who wrote the SI article for calling out players names with no alagations
Don't care how you slice it..
I don’t care how you slice it. In my eyes, Tressel saved Ohio State football. Not only did he give us an amazing record against Michican’t and the best BCS record, he fell on his sword for us. In my version of the story he heard “drugs” and “memorabilia for profit” and kept it hush. As any loving coach would. He had to leave to protect the image of our program. He did nothing but win in his tenure here and he did it in sweater vest senatorial style. I hope one day this all blows over and he still takes the AD job, as he should have in the natural course of things.
Until then I want winning seasons from Fickell and Meyer and I want JT to tear it up in the NFL.
I want to believe that so bad.
"What do we have here?"
"We're going to Saint Croix."
"We are? Oh, goody. I'm so happy."
"Well, I hope you're happy for us, because it's just Carrie and me."
"I see. Once again I humiliate myself by assuming that I'm a member of this family."
-Arthur and Doug, bantering about the Heffernan's vacation plans
Im the one Iowa fan that is kind of enjoying this probably a little too much
i admit it. but its not because OSU won alot against us or anything like that, i just dont like how the fanbase as a whole has been defending him. the thing is, if kids know they get money and cars and free tattoos, they are more inclined to go to that university than……..say……..a university who doesnt allow those things. thats a competitive recruiting advantage. its the same reason why we all hated USC, They were giving away cars and money too.
The other thing that gets me was that it was clear from comments and articles that ive read that people living in the area knew this kind of thing was going on, but didnt care because they were winning. i dont like that at all either. I dont live in Iowa City, but if i got a wiff of corruption i would probably at the very least bring it up at BHGP. The world is corrupt enough, i dont want it to be in my college sports as well, or at least let it be well enough hidden that i dont know.
by justsomehawkeyefan on Jun 2, 2011 1:37 AM EDT reply actions
If an NFL caliber recruit picks a school because he can get a better deals on tattoos then he is a moron.
Let’s be real here, there isn’t a damn recruit in the country with the potential to impact a program (guys who provide competitive advantages) that has tattoo discounts as the deciding factor on his school of choice over pedigree/location/NFL prospects/coaching staff/ability to play right away/tradition/etc. You can convince me that cars and money can sway a recruit to a program (Auburn, USC, SMU), but discount tattoos? Are you kidding me?

“C’mon man!”
"What do we have here?"
"We're going to Saint Croix."
"We are? Oh, goody. I'm so happy."
"Well, I hope you're happy for us, because it's just Carrie and me."
"I see. Once again I humiliate myself by assuming that I'm a member of this family."
-Arthur and Doug, bantering about the Heffernan's vacation plans
Your overestimating kids that age
of course free stuff could be the difference. 18 year olds are idiots for the most part, my brother picked his college because his girlfriend of 3 months was going there. and its not so much just the tattoos as much as the idea of getting free things while at OSU, whether it be tats, cars, lawn chairs, money, toothpaste etc etc, free stuff is free stuff
by justsomehawkeyefan on Jun 2, 2011 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions

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